After Jacare's loss....

how far does he drop in your rankings? how far does rockhold move up?

as for me, jacare fell just one spot to 4, and rockhold cracked my top 10

@Justynbomar he's been under TRT for a long while now. He's well aware of his testosterone levels and it pans out to be an excuse. It was basically dusted under the rug and if it was any other fighter Dana would have made a huge hissy fit. Since Sonnen is an entertainer with the social media and the way he has been stirring the pot with his recent interviews. Makes him more marketable and Dana White knows that. So of course they'll say about anything to put a blanket on the situation. There are tons of sources out there with different stories. There is no way we'll know the truth no matter how you cut it.
This is the past so it doesn't really matter now. This is where I like to question people's opinions on their rankings. You have Belfort who likes to stand and bang and of course he's going to make more mistakes facing a deadly striker like Anderson. Of course he'll get knocked out. That's his bread and butter. Yet you have Chael who is a wrestler who could probably dominate any fighter who doesn't have stellar TDD. So how does that work? Wins and losses seem to play a huge role and sway people's opinions with rankings, but to me it's much more.
It's all about opinions but you have to remember Vitor stands in front of his opponents and strikes. Chael takes people down and holds them there and uses his love taps to decision. 
I think it's more about dominance and how the finish comes into play and how well rounded they are with their skills throughout the years. Anderson should definitely be above Sonnen. I don't know how you could have Sonnen ahead of Anderson....boggles my mind. There might be some biased there but that's nuts.

I understand the loss/win affecting the rankings, but the bias and what not affects the personal rankings. There's just so much in depth to putting together rankings and I yet to find a perfect list. Maybe I'll make a list soon and everyone can pick it apart so I know what everyone's thoughts are on it.

@ BodyModifier - Well said on both posts!!!! I had to give you a bump on both of those!!!!

@ RWlawman - you pose a valid and good point. However; I like Vitor Belfort and can't stand "Mr. I do roids, make 1001 excuses for losses and doing roids, won't learn submission defense, and try to sell myself as the best fighter in the world even though I'm not" Chael Sonnen. So yeah, I might be a little biased, but depending on what happens between Bisping/Miller and Sonnen/Stann my personal rankings could change dramatically after those fights. I try to be as impartial as I can. The only reason Belfort is where he is, is because he's been fighting lately, and Sonnen, Bisping, and Miller haven't. Stann was relatively off the radar prior to his KO win over Chris Leben. The winner of Bisping/Miller will find himself in the top 5/10, and the winner of Sonnen/Stann will go to #2 or #3 with Belfort, Munoz, and Lombard dropping in ranks unless one of them has a really big win sometime soon.

The way I see it, despite Chael's inactivity and testosterone issue, he was still the closest to beating Anderson.  I don't think he "dominated" the fight as most people do.  I'm one to believe he wanted to submit Chael due to the comments about the Nog brothers, whether that's true is not the issue.  Vitor did not last a round with Anderson, hell Yushin Okami should be ranked over Vitor because beating Akiyama isn't that impressive.  I still think Vitor is a force and we shall see where the rankings stand after Vitor vs. Le and Sonnen vs. Stann.

@ justynbomar - TRT is a copout. In fact one doctor told me it's a disorder that happens most commonly among teenage boys not being able to produce or sustain normal levels of testoterone around or before the age of puberty. Chael Sonnen is a full grown man. I'm not saying that Sonnen doesn't have the disorder, but it's highly unlikely IMO. I'm not against the use of anabolic steroids or the use of performance enhancing drugs. In fact, I watched a documentary titled, "Bigger, Stronger, Faster", and according to the documentary, steroids aren't as bad as many have made them out to be, and that there is zero documented proof that anabolic steriods and other P.E.D.'s cause any health disorders. Actually, most anabolic steriods are used to help people with breathing disorders, inability to produce testosterone, and for cancer patients to build up their immune system while on Kemo, (I think that's how you spell it), but at this point in sports, they are banned substances for whatever reason. Sonnen tested positive, and still couldn't beat Anderson Silva, and Silva demolished his face from the bottom. Bottom line. 

Why compare Vitor's performance to Chael's? Anderson is known to have a weakness against credential wrestlers. Chael exposed that. Vitor stood in front of him and got knocked the **** out. It's expected when styles make fights and someone bold enough stands with Anderson and makes an error. It's easy to make an error when two elite strikers stand toe to toe. When you have Chael mixing up his take downs and his strikes to get that take down. Including Anderson having a rib injury. Add to that Chael under steroid use. Then of course Chael is going to fare well against the champion. What about his previous fights? Was he so dominant? How many finishes does he have? How many times has he been submitted? What does he have to offer as a fighter? I won't discredit Chael but to hold him high on a pedestal just because his style fits perfect for Anderson is a bit far fetched. 
We'll see how well Chael does if he beats Stann. Until then I haven't been completely impressed by him as a fighter. Add the negative spotlight and the mouth he has to hype up his fights. Doesn't really excite me. 
JayKool I love your posts so far and I'm glad that you don't let your rankings get out of control with your own bias. 
I'm not fond on Sonnen either but of course I'm not going to be unreasonable about where he stands in the ranks.

@ Crumx7 - Good post, and I agree with you. For me the question still remains, what happens if Sonnen loses to Stann? Until/Unless Sonnen beats Stann, then Sonnen is going to stay on my rankings where he is.

The reason I rank Vitor where I do, isn't just because of his UFC record. It was his win streak coming into the UFC. Granted, he didn't beat the best MWs, but around the world, they were relevant MWs, along with his win over Rich Franklin, I think that Belfort should be ranked in the top 5, but the winner of Miller/Bisping and Sonnen/Stann will drastically change those rankings unless Belfort beats someone in the top 5 in the MW division.

@ BodyModifier - Thank you!!!! Your last post was awesome!!!! That's the point that I've been trying to get across, and you said it perfectly!!!! Thank you!!!! I had to give you thumbs up on your last post.

I don't think it was that great of a point at all, no offense.  You're comparing things that have no business in a rankings list.  The fact of the matter is, Vitor Belfort stood in front of Anderson Silva in a come back fight after a TWO YEAR layoff, and got knocked out (as expected.)  After that, Belfort beat Aikiyama who isn't even a top 15 ranked middleweight.

Why compare Chael to Belfort?  Because some people have Belfort ranked above Sonnen.  It doesn't matter that Sonnen used wrestling to expose Silva, because he used SKILL to WIN.  That's what it's all about!  You don't have to stand and trade with Silva to be ranked, that's crazy.  Chael did exactly what he was supposed to do, and found a formula to almost defeat the champion, and bar that triangle choke, he would have.  Also, Sonnen's recent resume is more impressive than Belfort's.  Plain and simply, Sonnen should be ranked above Belfort on EVERY list that is to be taken seriously.

@ RWLawman - There's no category for an almost win. Sonnen still lost.

* Edited at 09.14.2011, 7:10 PM ET *

Whether or not Chael Sonnen should be ranked above Vitor Belfort or Vitor Belfort should be ranked above Chael Sonnen is all a matter of opinion. Perception is in the eyes of the beholder.

I never once said that Vitor should be ranked higher because he stood and banged with Anderson but there's more to the ranking system than just win/losses and records and their past performances. There's so much that ties into this that it's all just opinion and nothing is factual. There will be no perfect list. Vitor or any striker will be known to eventually get knocked out or tagged so therefore they will fall down the list quicker than anything. You also have fighters that jump in for another opponent that was injured and then they are forgotten or knocked down the ladder. Tito Ortiz is an example.
You also have injuries which isn't an excuse but is a hinder in performances. You have fighters that are found under the influence of steroid use. You have fighters that have family problems or weren't mentally prepared. The list can carry on forever and it can easily be avoided. I'm not saying these are excuses but there's so much to ranking and opinions that it can get out of hand.
Then there is styles that make fights and then there is hyped up fighters that come in and get a shot before other fighters that have been waiting in line. 
It all comes down to who won the fight or loss and everything I just posted doesn't matter because a fight is a fight, but I like to think it's more sensitive than that.
When was the last time Sonnen has finished anyone? wasn't it in like 2007? I don't know I was just never really impressed by Sonnen. To each their own.

That's why I don't make up lists. Too many factors and things I can't wrap my brain around. I agree with all lists just not having Sonnen in front of Anderson. I also don't agree with Belfort not getting the credit he deserves in his rightful ranking spot.

yes, Sonnen still lost, and so did Belfort.  Who did better?

There's no category for who did better!!!! They both lost, but since the loss Belfort has fought and won. Until Sonnen beats Stann, I have Belfort above Sonnen..........................and that's the bottom line..............cuz Jay Kool said so!!!! LOL!!!!

and I don't like Chael Sonnen. LOL!!!!

I don't like Sonnen either, I just try to keep an honest list. 

@ BM - don't worry bro, I've got your back on this one. I still can't stand Sonnen either!!!! IMO, he's a loudmouth who likes the sound of his own voice too much. You would think after being submitted by a Muay Thai striker he would be humbled into learning some submission defense, and giving credit where credit is due, but no, he just continues running his mouth, hyping himself up to the point of complete dilusion.

 

Okay so if there was a category for beating Akiyama, I would rank Belfort number one if that makes you feel better.  If Stann beats Sonnen then he will easily be in the top 5.  I'm not ranking Sonnen high because I like him, I'm ranking him high because he did the best out of anyone who has face Silva.  Vitor is high on my list because he remains a prospect, the performance he put on against Akiyama showed that, he will beat Cung Le.  Like jaykool said, these next 2 huge middleweight fights with Stann/Sonnen and Miller/Bisping will show us where we can rank these respective fighters. 

I really hope Vitor gets another oppurtunity at Anderson. Fans that don't know Vitor and what he's capable of might be surprised by the outcome of a Belfort/Silva 2 match up.

i dont think he should get another shot at silva at all

i think after chael beats stann they should have their rematch and vitor should face stann or the winner of the miller v bisbing fight or the munoz v leban fight