SAKU

I recently watched some early Pride DVDs,  Pride 1-8 to be specific. Sakuraba is the **** and I mean no disrespect, but does anyone else think some of the stoppages were suspect? In his bout with Anthony Macias, I didn't see a tap and the bell rang like 1 second after the ref stopped the fight. The Royler Gracie stoppage was also a *** moment for me. I know this is "Jesus riding dinosaurs" old but I wanted to know if you guys think some of these fights were not so much "fixed" for him, but perhaps had some suspect refereeing in his favor? Also, watching Mark Coleman tap to the Takada heel hook was like watching old school WWF wrasslin'.

I lived in Tokyo in 2007-08 and caught quite a few good shows.

Saw PRIDE 34 (that's where I "fell in love" with Shinya Aoki) and saw Sakuraba in 2007 K-1 Dynamite!! (damn Minowaman lost!) against Funaki and in saw him lose to Manhoef in DREAM 4 ("Mayhem" Miller lost there too, though I had no idea who he was at the time). Mousasi and Overeem won on that card too ... I guess that's one of the reasons I want Overeem to beat JDS ... we go way back :)

The atmosphere in Japan was sick ... I've never been to a UFC show so I can't compare, but Japan was crazy!

I guess some of the fights were fixed or shall I say "manipulated" to some extent, but you have to understand, the sport was different back then, It wasn't about records and belts (even though they existed), it was about fighting and to some extent giving the fans what (and who) they wanted. 

I actually like what the sport's become and it's a natural and positive evolution, even with the addition of "game planning" and "picky fight choosing" ... but that doesn't mean I won't always have a soft spot in my heart for the crazy Japan days ...

* Edited at 10.25.2012, 6:56 PM ET *

Takada/Coleman was pretty clearly fixed, as was probably every Takada fight that he won. I can't say anything about the Sakuraba fights as I've never noticed anything, but I guess I wouldn't put it past Pride. At the same time, there is no way the Gracies would be in on it, they have way too much family Pride to let anyone submit them (which is why they never really tapped). And I doubt Sak needed any help with Macias, he did tap Renzo. 

I guess a possible reasoning for the quick bell was to let Sakuraba know to let go of the lock? Like a whistle in soccer or something.

Thanks for responding, guys. @Yoss that's awseome, big ups. @minotauro I see your point and I agree. Also, why did Sakuraba have to fight Royce for an unlimited amount of rounds (6 rounds!) in the 2000 Grand Prix when other fighters on the card only fought the usual amount. I ask this as an early pride noob as I did not start following mma until I was 21 (2005) and I'm catching up on the old Pride stuff because I was UFC breast-fed.

@Cal, Im pretty sure the Gracies asked for the no time limit. I think that was the fight where they also demanded that the only way the fight would end was if Royce tapped (no ref stoppages)

^^^This is pretty much right. Since Sakuraba had defeated a few Gracies, Royce made a clause that if they fought each other in the openweight tournament it would have to be a no limit, no resets, no ref stoppages. Since there was no resets, there was a lot of stalling in corners. Also I'm pretty sure the finals of the GP, between Coleman and Vovchanchyn was a no limit bout as well, but Coleman had a ton of gas since Fujita's corner threw the towel immediately the bout before and Vovchanchyn was a little gassed already from having a war with Sakuraba.

Yeah, I doubt Sakuraba's fights with Gracies were fixed. I mean the dude broke Renzo's arm. He would have most likely broke Royler's arm too if the ref didn't stop that fight. 

Thanks for the discussion everyone. After watching the Mezger vs. Sakuraba fight, I have come to the conclusion that early PRIDE bouts were indeed very suspect. But bad judging can still be seen today, so I will just drop my conspiracy **** and finish watching the rest of my PRIDE DVDs and enjoy them.

On a side note, seeing Wanderlai Silva in his first two PRIDE bouts was cool. In the first one, I'm thinking "Oh **** here comes the vicious hooks and knees from the Axe Murderer"... bout ended in dec. Watched 2nd bout, and he wins with a RNC. I'm like "*** WHERE ARE THE PRIDE WANDY HIGHLIGHTS OF HIM MURDERING PEOPLE", I guess I will get to those soon enough.