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Topic: UFC Fight Night

UFC Fight Night: Overeem vs. Harris

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Tapology
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02.21.2020 | 2:59 PM ET

The official Tapology discussion thread for the event!
UFC Fight Night
  • Saturday 05.16.2020 at 06:00 PM ET
  • U.S. Broadcast: ESPN | Prelims: ESPN+
  • Name: UFC Fight Night: Overeem vs. Harris
  • Also Known As: UFC Fight Night Jacksonville
  • Promotion: Ultimate Fighting Championship
  • Ownership: Endeavor
  • Venue: VyStar Veterans Memorial Arena
  • Location: Jacksonville, Florida, United States
  • Enclosure: Octagon
  • TV Announcers: Brendan Fitzgerald, Michael Bisping, Paul Felder
  • Ring Announcer: Bruce Buffer
  • Post-Fight Interviews: Paul Felder
  • TV Ratings: 1.2M avg. viewers (690k ESPN prelims)
  • MMA Bouts: 11
  • Promotion Links:
  • Event Links:
Bout   Info
Alistair Overeem   defeats   Walt Harris   via KO/TKO, Ground and Pound   3:00 Round 2 of 5, 8:00 Total Bout Page
Cláudia Gadelha   defeats   Angela Hill   via Decision, Split   3 Rounds, 15:00 Total Bout Page
Dan Ige   defeats   Edson Barboza   via Decision, Split   3 Rounds, 15:00 Total Bout Page
Krzysztof Jotko   defeats   Eryk Anders   via Decision, Unanimous   3 Rounds, 15:00 Total Bout Page
Yadong Song   defeats   Marlon Vera   via Decision, Unanimous   3 Rounds, 15:00 Total Bout Page
Miguel Baeza   defeats   Matt Brown   via KO/TKO, Left Hook   0:18 Round 2 of 3, 5:18 Total Bout Page
Kevin Holland   defeats   Anthony Hernandez   via KO/TKO, Knee to the Body to Ground and Pound   0:39 Round 1 of 3 Bout Page
Giga Chikadze   defeats   Irwin Rivera   via Decision, Unanimous   3 Rounds, 15:00 Total Bout Page
Nate Landwehr   defeats   Darren Elkins   via Decision, Unanimous   3 Rounds, 15:00 Total Bout Page
Cortney Casey   defeats   Mara Romero Borella   via Submission, Armbar   3:36 Round 1 of 3 Bout Page
Rodrigo Nascimento   defeats   Don'Tale Mayes   via Submission, Rear Naked Choke   2:05 Round 2 of 3, 7:05 Total Bout Page

Responses Page 39

phillip53
phillip53
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05.17.2020 | 5:55 PM ET

Predictions: 5 of 11 Winners, 4 Perfect, 400 Points   |   Tied for 1350th

all i know is bad judging is ruining the sport and makes it extremely dangerous to bet real time. how about this? 


if the fight doesnt end in a finish its a no contest on both fighters record

1) eliminates the judges entirely

2) incentive for fighters and corners to train and fight for the finish.

"if one person dies its a tragedy, if a million people die its a statistic." joseph stalin

ImperatorFishrat
ImperatorFishrat
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05.17.2020 | 6:07 PM ET

Predictions: 6 of 10 Winners, 2 Perfect, 390 Points   |   Tied for 1373rd

@magestratu you're not understanding the criteria.

Please read the post I just made on this subject.

"A forest is not a field of trees."

ImperatorFishrat
ImperatorFishrat
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05.17.2020 | 6:19 PM ET

Predictions: 6 of 10 Winners, 2 Perfect, 390 Points   |   Tied for 1373rd

I'll actually post it here because this guy doesn't get it at all:

First up, don't get your Nerd rage boners in a twist;  a lot of judging does come down to the subjective interpretations of the viewers and I understand and accept this. There's many situations which arise when fans and Judges will be a 50/50 on the outcome of a given contest and rightly so, because determining which fighter had an advantage over the other is sometimes virtually impossible. Sometimes, all things are seemingly equal.


In such a cases a 10-10 should be awarded, but judges don't like draws in MMA and they are simply not awarded enough. They definitely need to be issued more. Then we can all complain about it the way we do in Boxing.

Does this mean you can just whip your **** out and point it at who you think won the fight? **** no.
There be rules. And I'm going to explain to you how they work.




Now let's talk about the prime criterion by which MMA fighting is judged: Damage.

The philosophy behind Judging is based and built around damage, as is the system used to score rounds. Both the practical interpretation and logic of scoring MMA is centered around, quite simply, who hurt who more. 

Literally every other aspect of scoring fighting is tributary and commentary damage. If one fighter appears to have caused more damage to another fighter in any given round, they should, according to the rules, be given the round. That's not the end of the story however.

This is because there's two types of damage assessed by Judges: Immediate and cumulative. Not only is immediate damage the primary criterion, but if this is met within a round by one fighter, absolutely no other scoring considerations may enter the decision making processes of the Judging panel. This is because the best evidence that a ighter caused damage to another fighter is...well, that they hurt them. Getting wobbled and/or rocked/dropped is the strongest primary visible evidence judges can use to determine who hurt who more.

How do I know this? Because it's explicitly stated in the rules. Here it is Verbatim:

 “Legal blows that have immediate or cumulative impact with the potential to contribute towards the end of the match with the IMMEDIATE weighing in more heavily than the cumulative impact. Successful execution of takedowns, submission attempts, reversals and the achievement of advantageous positions that produce immediate or cumulative impact with the potential to contribute to the end of the match, with the IMMEDIATE weighing more heavily than the cumulative impact".

You know how you'll see someone score a round for some fighter who landed  massively more strikes that had no effect on the other fighter,  but ate like 4-5 massive bombs in the round that cut them/caused them to back up?

Yeah, that guy is a ****gibbon who doesn't understand how MMA is scored.  

You know that guy who scores the round for a fighter because they had three and a half minutes of top control time after getting wobbled bigly, nearly going out, then shooting on the other fighter and laying on him/her like a drunk sea lion trying to **** a surfboard and says 'herpa derpa but derpa derpa controls fite more of time so s/he win round'?

So's that guy.

The reason for this is because clauses in the criteria which denote observable phenomena into an hierarchical  system of tiered value judgments which have 'veto powers' over one another based on their position in said hierarchy.


Or more simply, some things trump other things to such an extent that those other things can't even be considered by the judges when handing out scores.

Listen up Timmy,  because this next part is going to undo your ******ation and make of you a scoring pro: 

There are three types of observable phenomena judges look for when scoring a fight. They are:

Damage
Aggressiveness
Control

These three considerations act kind of like a kind of tiered judiciary in reverse order. Basically, the Damage criterion is the High court or the Supreme Court. Then you have Aggressiveness which is you local magistrate court. Then, you have control which like a tribunal. 

Don't believe this either? I refer you to this:

"Effective Striking/Grappling shall be considered the first priority of round assessments. Effective Aggressiveness is a ‘Plan B’ and should not be considered unless the judge does not see ANY advantage in the Effective Striking/Grappling realm. Cage/Ring Control (‘Plan C’) should only be needed when ALL other criteria are 100% even for both competitors. This will be an extremely rare occurrence"

Judges will attempt to decide a round based on, as stated earlier who hurt who more. If they can do this based on the ultimate criterion of damage, then they will not consult the other two 'slave' powers of aggressiveness and control.  This is because those two slave powers cannot overrule the judgement of the highest court in the land, which is Damage.The tail does not wag the Dog. A stream cannot rise above its source.


If the judges cannot determine that one fighter displayed an advantage over another according to damage, then they will look attempt to make a determination of who won the round by consulting the slave power of Aggression. This is because it is more likely that the person pushing the fight has been damaged less than the person doing the backing up.

If the judges cannot determine whether one fighter displayed an advantage over another according to criterion of Aggressiveness, they will consult the slave power of control. This is because at the end of all things, in a situation where no other value judgement can be used to determine a winner, who won a round simply comes down to had their way more often.

What Judges will never--I repeat never--do, is calculate all those decision-making factors and decide who did more of everything overall and determine the winner based on a total. A kilogram of feathers is a lot more stuff than a kilogram of gold visibly, but is worth a lot less in terms of value.


And that is how the system is designed, how it works, and how it is meant to used. That's it. Anyone who says this is not the case doesn't understand MMA judging; they are simply operating off their home-brewed wisdom, and should be disregarded out of hand.

Deuces. 

* Edited at 05.17.2020, 7:16 PM ET *

"A forest is not a field of trees."

NickySwaz
NickySwaz
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05.18.2020 | 12:40 AM ET

Predictions: 6 of 11 Winners, 3 Perfect, 390 Points   |   Tied for 1373rd

As I said Edson and chito, throw hill in there. @fish good looks

"I ain't the same person I was when I bit that guy's ear off." -Mike Tyson

Joshjeffords
Joshjeffords
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05.18.2020 | 2:54 PM ET

Predictions: 6 of 11 Winners, 1 Perfect, 365 Points   |   Tied for 1579th

LOL the CRITERIA WARS!!! DUN DUN DUN!
Nate Diaz "sa fight right sa fight ..rest unrepeatable or understandable"
Nate being the victim of lots of bad decisions and hits to the head oughta know.
I gotta go with fish even if a bad strike causes a cut its still fight ending pos damage.
A good solid punch has little effect esp from lil guys unless it hits exactly the right spot.
The only real point is just ******* finish the fight and stop blaming others for your losses period.
That being said I still always root for guy with better technique and hope best man wins, I'm often let down.   

"You can do anything all you need is will power"

ImperatorFishrat
ImperatorFishrat
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05.18.2020 | 3:41 PM ET

Predictions: 6 of 10 Winners, 2 Perfect, 390 Points   |   Tied for 1373rd

lol literally everyone who downvoted my post:





"A forest is not a field of trees."

ImperatorFishrat
ImperatorFishrat
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05.18.2020 | 3:54 PM ET

Predictions: 6 of 10 Winners, 2 Perfect, 390 Points   |   Tied for 1373rd

@Mickey I also don't mind if you scored the fight for Ige. I watched it again yesterday and it was close. I still have it for Barboza, but it's nowhere near the same deal as Hill vs Gadelha.

"A forest is not a field of trees."

DamienHandel420
DamienHandel420
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05.18.2020 | 4:18 PM ET

Predictions: 9 of 11 Winners, 2 Perfect, 555 Points   |   Tied for 239th

Song Yadong is the first hypetrain I want derailed in a long time because of his last 2 fight being ******** decsion as Stamman whoop his ass and somehow was a draw and the fight a few day ago. It not Song fault but still I want whoever backing him to cry tears

* Edited at 05.18.2020, 4:20 PM ET *

"Qwack Qwack Qwack"

ImperatorFishrat
ImperatorFishrat
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05.18.2020 | 4:24 PM ET

Predictions: 6 of 10 Winners, 2 Perfect, 390 Points   |   Tied for 1373rd

I don't think it will make any difference to the congenital imbeciles in this thread who seem to think their home brewed wisdom is the judging criteria, but here's Big John, who helped write the rules, telling you all  why I'm right. Skip to 6:00


* Edited at 05.18.2020, 4:24 PM ET *

"A forest is not a field of trees."

FergboyMMA
FergboyMMA
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05.22.2020 | 1:10 PM ET

You pretty much predicted the entire fight lol 
pie2munch
pie2munch
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05.22.2020 | 1:39 PM ET

Predictions: 5 of 11 Winners, 2 Perfect, 355 Points   |   Tied for 1683rd

I’d rather comment in the judging thread

10-9 

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