Topic: Top Lightweights - 155 lbs.

let's discuss our LW rankings

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gunn4206
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07.12.2013 | 7:06 PM ET

alright bill hopefully this should work for you ...

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AnAlias
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08.25.2013 | 10:37 AM ET

Inactivity and losing fights are two things that should very well lower a fighter's ranking, no? 

Like I said in my earlier post, what at least my rankings come down to is how a fighter's relatively recent accomplishments stack up against what other fighters have recently accomplished.  


Lightweight is a very competitive division and Maynard's accomplishments are dated.  The Diaz win was over 3 years ago and the Miller win was over 4.  His sole win since 2010 over Guida is technically more relevant, but the fight was a joke.  Meanwhile, other fighters have been fighting far more often and winning in impressive fashion.  All of that combined with being stopped by strikes in 2 of his last 3, makes him obviously not top 5 in my opinion. 

I can see still having him in the top 10, but the top 5 should be reserved for only the most elite and deserving fighters.  The question I suppose is....How long should 3+ year old wins hold a spot for a fighter who has been stopped by strikes in 2 of his last 3 and whose only recent win is one of the worst fights in recent memory?  
Franklin880088
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08.25.2013 | 12:27 PM ET

I want to take back my statement. I believe thomson should be top 5 in the division. I believe he top 3 but can easily see not ranking him in the top 3. Though I still believe Thomson is a horrible match up for Bendo.  You have an elite striker with amazing take down defense. Think Bendo would be getting the worse of it standing and would not be able to get Thomson down. Even if he got him down, Thomson is extremely good off his back. Also like Bendo, Thomson is a work horse so he can match Bendo pace all day. Thomson may not be the best LW in  the world, but I believe he would be a bad matchuo for Bendo.  

* Edited at 08.25.2013, 12:34 PM ET *

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mulefloyd
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08.25.2013 | 1:48 PM ET

Very fluid rankings at the moment. Even though Maynard's win over Diaz is that old, it's hard for me to rank Diaz ahead of him. A rematch would be a good fight to make. 

Johnson over Lauzon did for the LW division what the main event did to the LHW division. Personally I think it makes things more interesting.

In my mind the UFC top 5 & Chanlder (and maybe still Alvarez) have separated themselves from the pack. 6-25 or 30 are all bunched together with Jury and Khabib being the clear rising stars with the best shot of cracking the top level.








* Edited at 08.25.2013, 1:50 PM ET *

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Bill Burgess
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08.25.2013 | 2:53 PM ET

Top Tier: Benson Henderson, Gilbert Melendez, Gray Maynard, TJ Grant, Josh Thomson, Anthony Pettis, Joe Lauzon,  Takanori Gomi, Diego Sanchez, Nate Diaz

Mid-Tier: Jim Miller, Khabib Nurmagomedov, Eddie Alvarez, Donald Cerrone, Michael Chandler, Melvin Guillard, Jamie Varner, Ross Pearson, Sam Stout,

Bottom Tier: Curt Warburton, Kyle Watson, Matt Wiman, Andre Winner, Yves Edwards, Edson Barboza, Mark Bocek, Danny Castillo, Mac Danzig, Rafael Dos Anjos, Evan Dunham, Michael Johnson, Nik Lentz, John Makdessi, Anthony Njokuani, Aaron Riley, Shane Roller, George Sotiropoulos, Thiago Tavares, Paul Taylor, Gleison Tibau.

This division lost some good fighters when Frankie Edgar and Clay Guida moved down to FW.  Seasoned vet Spence Fisher has all but stopped fighting, as has Sean Sherk. It would be significantly strengthened by the additions of BJ Penn, Jose Aldo, and Eddie Alvarez.  Penn is a big question mark, as to whether or not he is retired or not.  

My 11-19

11. Jim Miller
12. Khabib Nurmagomedov
13. Eddie Alvarez
14. Donald Cerrone
15. Michael Chandler
16. Melvin Guillard
17. Jamie Varner
18. Ross Pearson
19. Sam Stout

Coming LW fights:

Donald Cerrone vs. Rafael dos Anjos, August 28, 2013, UFC on Fox Sports 1
Roger Bowling vs. Abel Trujillo, August 28, 2013, UFC on Fox Sports 1
Benson Henderson vs. Anthony Pettis, August 31, 2013, UFC 164
Jamie Varner vs. Gleison "Tibau, August 31, 2013, UFC 164
Ryan Couture vs. Al Iaquinta, August 31, 2013, UFC 164
Francisco Trinaldo vs. Piotr Hallmann, September 4, 2013, UFC Fight Night 28
Mike Ricci vs. Myles Jury, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
Mark Bocek vs. Michael Prazeres, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
Pat Healy vs. Khabib Nurmagomedov, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
John Makdessi vs. Renee Forte, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
Jesse Ronson vs. Michael Prazeres, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
Diego Sanchez vs. Gilbert Melendez, October 19, 2013, UFC 166
George Sotiropoulos vs. KJ Noons, October 19, 2013, UFC 166
Tony Ferguson vs. Mike Rio, October 19, 2013, UFC 166
Ross Pearson vs. Melvin Guillard, October 26, 2013, UFC Fight Night 30
Paul Taylor vs. Anthony Njokuani, October 26, 2013, UFC Fight Night 30
Jorge Masvidal vs. Rustam Khabilov, November 6, 2013, UFC Fight for the Troops 3
Colton Smith vs. Michael Chiesa, November 6, 2013, UFC Fight for the Troops 3

Presently, the following are not matched up in fights yet: Gray Maynard, Josh Thomson, Jim Miller, Takanori Gomi, Sam Stout, Spencer Fisher.

Some of the above fighters are just after having fought recently.

Injured: TJ Grant

The above listing is tentative and soft.  I are prepared to adjust the sequence to some extent based on the order of the house.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
To assist everyone, here is the form chart for tapology,
1. Henderson 2. Melendez 3. Pettis 4. Grant 5. Cerrone 6. Maynard 7. Thomson 8. Chandler 9. Diaz 10. Miller 

11. Alvarez 12. Healy 13. Nurmagomedov 14. Lauzon 15. Aoki 16. Anjos 17. Varner 18. Barboza 19. Dunham 20. Tibau

21. Guillard 22. Gomi 23. Sanchez 24. Wiman 25. Masvidal 26. Jury 27. Pearson 28. Bocek 29. Castillo 30. Green
--------------------------------------
Official UFC Rankings, as of July 8, 2013.
1. Henderson 2. Melendez 3. Pettis 4. Grant 5. Thomson 6. Maynard 7. Cerrone 8. Niaz 9. Miller 10. Healy 11. dos Anjos
------------------------------------------------
I agree that LW is probably the most fluid division at the moment.  It seems that on any given day, anyone can defeat anyone else.  I was really shocked when Michael Johnson not only beat Joe Lauzon but made him look lackluster in the process.  And all before Joe's home crowd, who were there to cheer on their homeboy.

Another name that could throw things into even further disarray is Russian-born Rustam Khabilov.  He has the potential to cause chaos in an already messy rankings.  His fight with Jorge Masvidal, November 6 promises mayhem and fireworks.  Can't hardly wait.

And still more confusion is possible if Eddie Alvarez loses his fight in Bellator to Michael Chandler.  If he loses, he will be free to sign with the UFC, without further resistance from Bellator.  That gives me a funny feeling.  Knowing Eddie's heart was to move to the UFC, is is possible he would fight with a little less tenacity than his usual?  Not even knowing he's doing it?  

But if Eddie Alvarez does come to the UFC, I don't think he would create the same thing as I used to think.  I don't think he would be Top 10.  I hope he would be I'm afraid to count on him.  Too many disappointments from other people coming here and not living up to expectations.  

* Edited at 08.25.2013, 3:56 PM ET *

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KnockoutsRock21
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08.25.2013 | 3:01 PM ET

Bill why is Maynard ahead of Grant in your rankings? I'm a big Maynard fan but he got KTFO by Grant recently.

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Franklin880088
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08.25.2013 | 3:24 PM ET

How is Cerrone Mid Tier? There several guys in your top tier that Cerrone would beat down pretty badly. Like Gomi for instance would get dominated by Cerrone.

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ShakeANDBake720
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08.25.2013 | 3:26 PM ET

What? MJ is on low tier but J-Lau is still top tier after MJ just completely shut him down?

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KnockoutsRock21
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08.25.2013 | 3:27 PM ET

Jlau is top tier and Johnson is 3rd tier. We saw what happened in that fight. I think Chandler might be the best. We may never know though.

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Bill Burgess
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08.25.2013 | 3:43 PM ET

The above questions are all legitimate and I appreciate them, too.  The answer is simple.  I am not ranking them based on their last fights.  I am giving career and the last 3 fights some weight.

Before their last fight, Joe Lauzon was ranked WAY ahead of Michael Johnson.  And even though Johnson beat him, I will not use that to rank Johnson ahead of him.  Johnson must prove to me that he is really on Joe's level.  And if he is, he should have no problem demonstrating that in his next 2 fights.

Same thing with Grant and Maynard.  Before their last fight, Maynard was significantly better.  But if Grant is for real, he will continue to demonstrate it in his next 2 fights.

So, that is how I rank my fighters.  I am slow to elevate them, and equally slow to drop them down.  

Patience is a virtue.  Singular performances, no matter how impressive, must be followed by steady work at the same level moving forward.  That is how I separate the upsets, fighting above or below your true level.

Make any sense, fellas?  Thinks about it.

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mulefloyd
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08.25.2013 | 3:48 PM ET

Bill, they've added Michael Chiesa vs. Colton Smith (dropping from WW) to Fight Night 31: Fight for the Troops and Jesse Ronson is the replacement for Bocek vs. Michel Prazeres. Omielanczuk is a HW.

I would only have a problem with you always making your "top tier" 10 fighters. Like I said above, to me the top 6 (or 7 depending on what you think of Alvarez) have made themselves stand out. Whenever anyone from the 6-25 range fights someone from that top 6 the result has usually been definitive. 

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Bigj383
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08.25.2013 | 3:48 PM ET

After his recent performances J-Lau may very well be relegated to gatekeeper or Journyman fighter. His UFC career has been too inconsistant to be considered a top tier fighter. from 06 to 13. His record looks like WWWLWWLWLWWLWLL It's not like he's losing to just top tier fighters either. He has losses to Stout and Johnson with his best win being a toss up between Varner and Guilard.

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mulefloyd
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08.25.2013 | 3:53 PM ET

It's more important to take into career accomplishments with fighters who are known to have up and down performances but it is important to keep in mind, just as accomplishments in other weight classes should not be thrown out. That's why I think T.J. Grant has clearly demonstrated he's better than Gray. Undefeated at LW with only decision losses to Johny Hendricks, the Stun Gun, and Ricardo Almeida in the UFC (and former UFC MW Jesse Bongfeldt right before joining) and impressive stoppages of Wiman & Maynard but he was pretty even with Dunham and couldn't finish Prater so I can see your hesitance.

* Edited at 08.25.2013, 3:55 PM ET *

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amp112
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08.25.2013 | 4:04 PM ET

Lauzon is inconsistent which is why gatekeeper is a good term for him. He beat Guillard when Guillard was considered a top 10 fighter, but he lost to Johnson.
Bill Burgess
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08.25.2013 | 4:11 PM ET

Thanks, Mule for your help in keeping the coming fights up to date.  I fixed it.  It's hard to keep it up-to-the-minute, with them adding fights almost on a daily basis.  So I appreciate your help!  Your Top 5 has got to be one of the most courageous, confident, ballsiest rankings I've seen so far.

I'll have to think about Lauzon and Grant.  Maybe I've been taken in by the TV profiles and promotion on Lauzon.  They've invested in him and it's possible I've given him too much leeway and consideration.  But I don't think I've over-estimated Gray Maynard.  He's proven he's a top man so many times.  His fights with Florian, 3 with Edgar, Guida, Diaz more than prove his superior quality.  I've long believed that Maynard is one of the few with legitimate chances of de-throning Henderson.  

One loss to Grant cannot take all that quality away.  Grant lost to Kim and Hendricks back when, but he hasn't lost since Christmas, 2010.  His wins are not against the most impressive names in the UFC roster, but his win against Maynard in the first was a good one.  I just want to see him in his next 2 fights.  And who he fights will be very important to his ranking.

* Edited at 08.25.2013, 4:16 PM ET *

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Franklin880088
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08.25.2013 | 4:20 PM ET

Still think Maynard lost to Diaz and was gifted the win due to top control which he did nothing with except for eat a bunch of punches and avoid subs.

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amp112
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08.25.2013 | 4:33 PM ET

I had the fight for Diaz too. Gave him 1&3. Close fight though.
Bill Burgess
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08.25.2013 | 4:41 PM ET

I've just rethought my rankings.  I think my new order makes a little more sense.

Top Tier: Benson Henderson, Gilbert Melendez, Gray Maynard, TJ Grant, Josh Thomson, Michael Chandler, Eddie Alvarez, Khabib Nurmagomedov, Takanori Gomi.

Mid-Tier: Pat Healy, Nate Diaz, Donald Cerrone, Jim Miller, Joe Lauzon, Melvin Guillard, Jamie Varner, Jorge Masvidal, Rustam Khabilov, KJ Noons, Sam Stout, Rafael Dos Anjos, Ross Pearson.

Bottom Tier: Curt Warburton, Kyle Watson, Matt Wiman, Andre Winner, Yves Edwards, Edson Barboza, Mark Bocek, Danny Castillo, Mac Danzig, Evan Dunham, Michael Johnson, Nik Lentz, John Makdessi, Anthony Njokuani, Aaron Riley, Shane Roller, George Sotiropoulos, Thiago Tavares, Paul Taylor, Gleison Tibau.

This division lost some good fighters when Frankie Edgar and Clay Guida moved down to FW.  Seasoned vet Spence Fisher has all but stopped fighting, as has Sean Sherk. It would be significantly strengthened by the additions of BJ Penn, Jose Aldo, and Eddie Alvarez.  Penn is a big question mark, as to whether or not he is retired or not.  

My 11-23

11. Pat Healy
12. Nate Diaz
13. Donald Cerrone
14. Jim Miller
15. Joe Lauzon
16. Melvin Guillard
17. Jamie Varner
18. Jorge Masvidal
19. Rustam Khabilov
20. KJ Noons
21. Sam Stout
22. Rafael Dos Anjos
23. Ross Pearson

Coming LW fights:

Donald Cerrone vs. Rafael dos Anjos, August 28, 2013, UFC on Fox Sports 1
Roger Bowling vs. Abel Trujillo, August 28, 2013, UFC on Fox Sports 1
Benson Henderson vs. Anthony Pettis, August 31, 2013, UFC 164
Jamie Varner vs. Gleison "Tibau, August 31, 2013, UFC 164
Ryan Couture vs. Al Iaquinta, August 31, 2013, UFC 164
Francisco Trinaldo vs. Piotr Hallmann, September 4, 2013, UFC Fight Night 28
Mike Ricci vs. Myles Jury, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
Mark Bocek vs. Michael Prazeres, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
Pat Healy vs. Khabib Nurmagomedov, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
John Makdessi vs. Renee Forte, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
Jesse Ronson vs. Michael Prazeres, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
Diego Sanchez vs. Gilbert Melendez, October 19, 2013, UFC 166
George Sotiropoulos vs. KJ Noons, October 19, 2013, UFC 166
Tony Ferguson vs. Mike Rio, October 19, 2013, UFC 166
Ross Pearson vs. Melvin Guillard, October 26, 2013, UFC Fight Night 30
Paul Taylor vs. Anthony Njokuani, October 26, 2013, UFC Fight Night 30
Jorge Masvidal vs. Rustam Khabilov, November 6, 2013, UFC Fight for the Troops 3
Colton Smith vs. Michael Chiesa, November 6, 2013, UFC Fight for the Troops 3

Presently, the following are not matched up in fights yet: Gray Maynard, Josh Thomson, Jim Miller, Takanori Gomi, Sam Stout, Spencer Fisher.

Some of the above fighters are just after having fought recently.

Injured: TJ Grant

The above listing is tentative and soft.  I are prepared to adjust the sequence to some extent based on the order of the house.

* Edited at 08.25.2013, 4:56 PM ET *

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mulefloyd
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08.25.2013 | 4:51 PM ET

Except Diaz pretty much dominated Gomi :(

I think it's an impossible task at the moment Bill.

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Bill Burgess
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08.25.2013 | 4:54 PM ET

LW might be Rubik's Cube.  Just when you get one piece in place, it changes something else.  I just switched Diaz and Miller.  Are we having fun yet?

* Edited at 08.25.2013, 4:56 PM ET *

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CthulhuJones
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08.25.2013 | 5:00 PM ET

Why would you drop Nate Diaz under Cerrone and Jim Miller when he dominated both of those guys? Also, Gomi at 10 is mind blowing.
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