Topic: Top Lightweights - 155 lbs.
let's discuss our LW rankings
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07.12.2013 | 7:06 PM ET
"RIP Bill Burgess , RIP CthuluJones"
Responses Page 3
08.25.2013 | 10:37 AM ET
Like I said in my earlier post, what at least my rankings come down to is how a fighter's relatively recent accomplishments stack up against what other fighters have recently accomplished.
Lightweight is a very competitive division and Maynard's accomplishments are dated. The Diaz win was over 3 years ago and the Miller win was over 4. His sole win since 2010 over Guida is technically more relevant, but the fight was a joke. Meanwhile, other fighters have been fighting far more often and winning in impressive fashion. All of that combined with being stopped by strikes in 2 of his last 3, makes him obviously not top 5 in my opinion.
I can see still having him in the top 10, but the top 5 should be reserved for only the most elite and deserving fighters. The question I suppose is....How long should 3+ year old wins hold a spot for a fighter who has been stopped by strikes in 2 of his last 3 and whose only recent win is one of the worst fights in recent memory?
08.25.2013 | 12:27 PM ET
* Edited at 08.25.2013, 12:34 PM ET *
"here I come to save the day"
08.25.2013 | 1:48 PM ET
Johnson over Lauzon did for the LW division what the main event did to the LHW division. Personally I think it makes things more interesting.
In my mind the UFC top 5 & Chanlder (and maybe still Alvarez) have separated themselves from the pack. 6-25 or 30 are all bunched together with Jury and Khabib being the clear rising stars with the best shot of cracking the top level.
* Edited at 08.25.2013, 1:50 PM ET *
"Grammar. The difference between knowing your **** and knowing you're ****."
08.25.2013 | 2:53 PM ET
Mid-Tier: Jim Miller, Khabib Nurmagomedov, Eddie Alvarez, Donald Cerrone, Michael Chandler, Melvin Guillard, Jamie Varner, Ross Pearson, Sam Stout,
Bottom Tier: Curt Warburton, Kyle Watson, Matt Wiman, Andre Winner, Yves Edwards, Edson Barboza, Mark Bocek, Danny Castillo, Mac Danzig, Rafael Dos Anjos, Evan Dunham, Michael Johnson, Nik Lentz, John Makdessi, Anthony Njokuani, Aaron Riley, Shane Roller, George Sotiropoulos, Thiago Tavares, Paul Taylor, Gleison Tibau.
This division lost some good fighters when Frankie Edgar and Clay Guida moved down to FW. Seasoned vet Spence Fisher has all but stopped fighting, as has Sean Sherk. It would be significantly strengthened by the additions of BJ Penn, Jose Aldo, and Eddie Alvarez. Penn is a big question mark, as to whether or not he is retired or not.
My 11-19
11. Jim Miller
12. Khabib Nurmagomedov
13. Eddie Alvarez
14. Donald Cerrone
15. Michael Chandler
16. Melvin Guillard
17. Jamie Varner
18. Ross Pearson
19. Sam Stout
Coming LW fights:
Donald Cerrone vs. Rafael dos Anjos, August 28, 2013, UFC on Fox Sports 1
Roger Bowling vs. Abel Trujillo, August 28, 2013, UFC on Fox Sports 1
Benson Henderson vs. Anthony Pettis, August 31, 2013, UFC 164
Jamie Varner vs. Gleison "Tibau, August 31, 2013, UFC 164
Ryan Couture vs. Al Iaquinta, August 31, 2013, UFC 164
Francisco Trinaldo vs. Piotr Hallmann, September 4, 2013, UFC Fight Night 28
Mike Ricci vs. Myles Jury, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
Mark Bocek vs. Michael Prazeres, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
Pat Healy vs. Khabib Nurmagomedov, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
John Makdessi vs. Renee Forte, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
Jesse Ronson vs. Michael Prazeres, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
Diego Sanchez vs. Gilbert Melendez, October 19, 2013, UFC 166
George Sotiropoulos vs. KJ Noons, October 19, 2013, UFC 166
Tony Ferguson vs. Mike Rio, October 19, 2013, UFC 166
Ross Pearson vs. Melvin Guillard, October 26, 2013, UFC Fight Night 30
Paul Taylor vs. Anthony Njokuani, October 26, 2013, UFC Fight Night 30
Jorge Masvidal vs. Rustam Khabilov, November 6, 2013, UFC Fight for the Troops 3
Colton Smith vs. Michael Chiesa, November 6, 2013, UFC Fight for the Troops 3
Presently, the following are not matched up in fights yet: Gray Maynard, Josh Thomson, Jim Miller, Takanori Gomi, Sam Stout, Spencer Fisher.
Some of the above fighters are just after having fought recently.
Injured: TJ Grant
The above listing is tentative and soft. I are prepared to adjust the sequence to some extent based on the order of the house.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
To assist everyone, here is the form chart for tapology,
1. Henderson 2. Melendez 3. Pettis 4. Grant 5. Cerrone 6. Maynard 7. Thomson 8. Chandler 9. Diaz 10. Miller
11. Alvarez 12. Healy 13. Nurmagomedov 14. Lauzon 15. Aoki 16. Anjos 17. Varner 18. Barboza 19. Dunham 20. Tibau
21. Guillard 22. Gomi 23. Sanchez 24. Wiman 25. Masvidal 26. Jury 27. Pearson 28. Bocek 29. Castillo 30. Green
--------------------------------------
Official UFC Rankings, as of July 8, 2013.
1. Henderson 2. Melendez 3. Pettis 4. Grant 5. Thomson 6. Maynard 7. Cerrone 8. Niaz 9. Miller 10. Healy 11. dos Anjos
------------------------------------------------
I agree that LW is probably the most fluid division at the moment. It seems that on any given day, anyone can defeat anyone else. I was really shocked when Michael Johnson not only beat Joe Lauzon but made him look lackluster in the process. And all before Joe's home crowd, who were there to cheer on their homeboy.
Another name that could throw things into even further disarray is Russian-born Rustam Khabilov. He has the potential to cause chaos in an already messy rankings. His fight with Jorge Masvidal, November 6 promises mayhem and fireworks. Can't hardly wait.
And still more confusion is possible if Eddie Alvarez loses his fight in Bellator to Michael Chandler. If he loses, he will be free to sign with the UFC, without further resistance from Bellator. That gives me a funny feeling. Knowing Eddie's heart was to move to the UFC, is is possible he would fight with a little less tenacity than his usual? Not even knowing he's doing it?
But if Eddie Alvarez does come to the UFC, I don't think he would create the same thing as I used to think. I don't think he would be Top 10. I hope he would be I'm afraid to count on him. Too many disappointments from other people coming here and not living up to expectations.
* Edited at 08.25.2013, 3:56 PM ET *
"Love God, live with honor, keep your agreements."
08.25.2013 | 3:01 PM ET
"Superman wears Chuck Liddell pajamas"
08.25.2013 | 3:24 PM ET
"here I come to save the day"
08.25.2013 | 3:26 PM ET
"Duck, I want to sleep with my wife tonight,"
08.25.2013 | 3:27 PM ET
"Superman wears Chuck Liddell pajamas"
08.25.2013 | 3:43 PM ET
Before their last fight, Joe Lauzon was ranked WAY ahead of Michael Johnson. And even though Johnson beat him, I will not use that to rank Johnson ahead of him. Johnson must prove to me that he is really on Joe's level. And if he is, he should have no problem demonstrating that in his next 2 fights.
Same thing with Grant and Maynard. Before their last fight, Maynard was significantly better. But if Grant is for real, he will continue to demonstrate it in his next 2 fights.
So, that is how I rank my fighters. I am slow to elevate them, and equally slow to drop them down.
Patience is a virtue. Singular performances, no matter how impressive, must be followed by steady work at the same level moving forward. That is how I separate the upsets, fighting above or below your true level.
Make any sense, fellas? Thinks about it.
"Love God, live with honor, keep your agreements."
08.25.2013 | 3:48 PM ET
I would only have a problem with you always making your "top tier" 10 fighters. Like I said above, to me the top 6 (or 7 depending on what you think of Alvarez) have made themselves stand out. Whenever anyone from the 6-25 range fights someone from that top 6 the result has usually been definitive.
"Grammar. The difference between knowing your **** and knowing you're ****."
08.25.2013 | 3:48 PM ET
"It does not make sense that humans deliberately malfunction. - Upgrade"
08.25.2013 | 3:53 PM ET
* Edited at 08.25.2013, 3:55 PM ET *
"Grammar. The difference between knowing your **** and knowing you're ****."
08.25.2013 | 4:04 PM ET
08.25.2013 | 4:11 PM ET
I'll have to think about Lauzon and Grant. Maybe I've been taken in by the TV profiles and promotion on Lauzon. They've invested in him and it's possible I've given him too much leeway and consideration. But I don't think I've over-estimated Gray Maynard. He's proven he's a top man so many times. His fights with Florian, 3 with Edgar, Guida, Diaz more than prove his superior quality. I've long believed that Maynard is one of the few with legitimate chances of de-throning Henderson.
One loss to Grant cannot take all that quality away. Grant lost to Kim and Hendricks back when, but he hasn't lost since Christmas, 2010. His wins are not against the most impressive names in the UFC roster, but his win against Maynard in the first was a good one. I just want to see him in his next 2 fights. And who he fights will be very important to his ranking.
* Edited at 08.25.2013, 4:16 PM ET *
"Love God, live with honor, keep your agreements."
08.25.2013 | 4:20 PM ET
"here I come to save the day"
08.25.2013 | 4:33 PM ET
08.25.2013 | 4:41 PM ET
Top Tier: Benson Henderson, Gilbert Melendez, Gray Maynard, TJ Grant, Josh Thomson, Michael Chandler, Eddie Alvarez, Khabib Nurmagomedov, Takanori Gomi.
Mid-Tier: Pat Healy, Nate Diaz, Donald Cerrone, Jim Miller, Joe Lauzon, Melvin Guillard, Jamie Varner, Jorge Masvidal, Rustam Khabilov, KJ Noons, Sam Stout, Rafael Dos Anjos, Ross Pearson.
Bottom Tier: Curt Warburton, Kyle Watson, Matt Wiman, Andre Winner, Yves Edwards, Edson Barboza, Mark Bocek, Danny Castillo, Mac Danzig, Evan Dunham, Michael Johnson, Nik Lentz, John Makdessi, Anthony Njokuani, Aaron Riley, Shane Roller, George Sotiropoulos, Thiago Tavares, Paul Taylor, Gleison Tibau.
This division lost some good fighters when Frankie Edgar and Clay Guida moved down to FW. Seasoned vet Spence Fisher has all but stopped fighting, as has Sean Sherk. It would be significantly strengthened by the additions of BJ Penn, Jose Aldo, and Eddie Alvarez. Penn is a big question mark, as to whether or not he is retired or not.
My 11-23
11. Pat Healy
12. Nate Diaz
13. Donald Cerrone
14. Jim Miller
15. Joe Lauzon
16. Melvin Guillard
17. Jamie Varner
18. Jorge Masvidal
19. Rustam Khabilov
20. KJ Noons
21. Sam Stout
22. Rafael Dos Anjos
23. Ross Pearson
Coming LW fights:
Donald Cerrone vs. Rafael dos Anjos, August 28, 2013, UFC on Fox Sports 1
Roger Bowling vs. Abel Trujillo, August 28, 2013, UFC on Fox Sports 1
Benson Henderson vs. Anthony Pettis, August 31, 2013, UFC 164
Jamie Varner vs. Gleison "Tibau, August 31, 2013, UFC 164
Ryan Couture vs. Al Iaquinta, August 31, 2013, UFC 164
Francisco Trinaldo vs. Piotr Hallmann, September 4, 2013, UFC Fight Night 28
Mike Ricci vs. Myles Jury, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
Mark Bocek vs. Michael Prazeres, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
Pat Healy vs. Khabib Nurmagomedov, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
John Makdessi vs. Renee Forte, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
Jesse Ronson vs. Michael Prazeres, September 21, 2013, UFC 165
Diego Sanchez vs. Gilbert Melendez, October 19, 2013, UFC 166
George Sotiropoulos vs. KJ Noons, October 19, 2013, UFC 166
Tony Ferguson vs. Mike Rio, October 19, 2013, UFC 166
Ross Pearson vs. Melvin Guillard, October 26, 2013, UFC Fight Night 30
Paul Taylor vs. Anthony Njokuani, October 26, 2013, UFC Fight Night 30
Jorge Masvidal vs. Rustam Khabilov, November 6, 2013, UFC Fight for the Troops 3
Colton Smith vs. Michael Chiesa, November 6, 2013, UFC Fight for the Troops 3
Presently, the following are not matched up in fights yet: Gray Maynard, Josh Thomson, Jim Miller, Takanori Gomi, Sam Stout, Spencer Fisher.
Some of the above fighters are just after having fought recently.
Injured: TJ Grant
The above listing is tentative and soft. I are prepared to adjust the sequence to some extent based on the order of the house.
* Edited at 08.25.2013, 4:56 PM ET *
"Love God, live with honor, keep your agreements."
08.25.2013 | 4:51 PM ET
I think it's an impossible task at the moment Bill.
"Grammar. The difference between knowing your **** and knowing you're ****."
08.25.2013 | 4:54 PM ET
* Edited at 08.25.2013, 4:56 PM ET *
"Love God, live with honor, keep your agreements."
08.25.2013 | 5:00 PM ET